One for the British boardies. Who is watching Newsnight, with Nick Griffin, political leader of the British National Party getting an absolute grilling? I have to say this is incredibly important television.
For those not in the know, the BNP is, as far as I can tell, a poliitical party built around a fundamentally racist ideology. Who are frighteningly growing in popularity. And they have him on newsnight, and he is being strung out to dry. It's excellent.
This guy was a tweeting trend on twitter so i did a little reading to figure out who the fell he was, and I was thoroughly disgusted.
My trust in the human population is quickly declining. Although Im glad to hear he is getting his ass kicked.
I was watching it as I do think it's important that the public know a bit about the parties. Thankfully I think a lot of people have learnt about the BNP tonight. Generally very interesting viewing, though Jack Straw's defence of the immigration policy was dull politician-speak. Giving them airtime was definitely a good choice.
Since I can't see the Beeb here, I didn't watch it last night. However, I did read about it.
In my humble opinion, it is extremely important that all parties in an election get the same time on air. It wouldn't be much of a democracy if some parties were left out completely. All you can do is hope that most people recognise them as fools.
But be careful; here in Denmark, we have the Danish People's Party who are quite extreme in my opinion. Not as much as the BNP but still scary enough. They got about 13% of the votes at the previous elections.
By the way... We have local elections coming up in less than a month, and a morning TV show had invited some of the lesser known parties to explain their standpoints. One was the Nihilistic People's Party. Their basic message is that politics is shit and they are too, but at least they admit that they're no good. They wouldn't get my vote but somehow it's refreshing :)
Personally I am sickened by the "anti-facist" movement, to me it's the same as the bleeding heart liberals being up in arms about the Daily Mail article about Gately.
Yes you can have freedom of speech but only if we agree with it ??? WTF!!!!
I was watching it as I do think it's important that the public know a bit about the parties. Thankfully I think a lot of people have learnt about the BNP tonight. Generally very interesting viewing, though Jack Straw's defence of the immigration policy was dull politician-speak. Giving them airtime was definitely a good choice.
I got the impression he didn't get much airtime as people were shouting on top of his talking. Not a good idea, it only makes his supporters more keen, as he wasn't "treated fairly". Give them neutral air time to tell people what they are about, and there won't be any martyrish reactions to it, might even put more people off them. Apparently BBC got more complaints on his treatment than on his being there.
An English friend told me about him & his appearance on the show, and I don't really know what to say: the KKK is "almost completely non-violent"? homosexuality is "creepy"? Islam promotes murdering Jews? London has been "ethnically cleansed"? Huh? (I probably shouldn't say this, but this KIND OF reminds me of a certain Iranian politician...) - and now I read that the online-forums of the BBC were flooded with support-posts(!) for Griffin.
Not sure if it's such a wise idea to invite fascist politicians to such a discussion - apart from giving people wrong ideas and making HIM look like a victim (-> see the high number of pro-Griffin comments online), it also degrades the other panelists to "supporting actors"... on the other hand, democracy demands letting everyone voice their opinion...
(btw, what kind of a TIE was that round David Dimbleby's neck???)
Hanne wrote:
One was the Nihilistic People's Party. Their basic message is that politics is shit and they are too, but at least they admit that they're no good. They wouldn't get my vote but somehow it's refreshing :)
We had general elections in September, and one of the new parties was called "THE PIRATES"... ...
I watched it and was disgusted with everyone. It was not democracy, was very biased and unfair. What everyone failed to realise was that their own behaviour was appalling. Nobody should be subjected to that , no matter what their views are.
Personally I am sickened by the "anti-facist" movement, to me it's the same as the bleeding heart liberals being up in arms about the Daily Mail article about Gately.
Yes you can have freedom of speech but only if we agree with it ??? WTF!!!!
Dubz
This post is only, just, almost, rescued from the clutches of complete insanity by the use of quotation marks round "anti-fascist". Personally, I would rank "anti-fascism" up there with the best of things. Probably alongside boobs and my childhood teddy bear 'Big Ted'. As movements go, being "anti-facist" is pretty cool. It certainly beats being "pro-facist" or even just a middle of the road abstaining neutral who lets fascists go about their business and generally finds them inoffensive.
Freedom of speech is great, its an excellent priveledge. Thats why it was great to have Nick Griffin on Question time, as it is in the best interest of a free, democratic society, who's media presents no bias. And if he choses to go on the show, and the audience chose to destroy him in a particularly undignified and perhaps un-debate-like way, then thats his freedom of choice. Doesn't stop me believing his views to be fundamentally a-moral and more than a little racist, homophobic and laughable.
And as for the Jan Moir article on Steven Gately, you're confusing 'freedom of speech' with 'saying whatever the fuck you want'. Her article contravened a number of rudamentary principles of written news, not to mention codes of practice. Simple things such as adhering to the facts.
I suppose I could have replied to this with a simple 'what. the. fuck' but I felt the need to elaborate.
I watched it and was disgusted with everyone. It was not democracy, was very biased and unfair. What everyone failed to realise was that their own behaviour was appalling. Nobody should be subjected to that , no matter what their views are.
That's certainly an interesting view though I disagree with it almost completely. :) I don't think the behaviour of the opposing parties was bad, but given that all major parties are strongly opposed to the BNP it would always be hard to find people who would not try to tear him to shreds (though the triumphant looks when they forced him into a corner were perhaps a tad unnecessary). Let's face it, it keeps him in the news whilst also getting a sympathy vote for something which was quite clear from the outset.
I watched it and was disgusted with everyone. It was not democracy, was very biased and unfair. What everyone failed to realise was that their own behaviour was appalling. Nobody should be subjected to that , no matter what their views are.
That's certainly an interesting view though I disagree with it almost completely. :) I don't think the behaviour of the opposing parties was bad, but given that all major parties are strongly opposed to the BNP it would always be hard to find people who would not try to tear him to shreds (though the triumphant looks when they forced him into a corner were perhaps a tad unnecessary). Let's face it, it keeps him in the news whilst also getting a sympathy vote for something which was quite clear from the outset.
Hi :) I agree that it would be hard to find a panel that wasn't hostile but that said they are just promoting their own popularity by making a comment that they know is a majority vote winner. ( not on every issue of the BNP but it is a safe bet)
I believe any government of the day just makes rules to suit the economy and if it didn't suit the economy there wouldn't be a rule or a 'rule'might change ; I don't think policies often have anything to do with humanity, free speech , democracy or what is good for the country or the majority of people living in it.
We are supposed to be in democracy but have you ever seen so many rules??? and cameras???and penalties for just walking out of your door. Its a joke.
I dont agree with many BNP Policies ( but I think some of what Nick Griffin said held some water) but I do think they represent the voice of some people who have other views and they should be heard. What I like about him is that he is brave enough to say it. I also dont think he is necessarily the satan everyone has him down as. Its easy to get someone in a fowl mood , take their picture and then state " A disgrace to humanity" . Is Jack Straw a martyr - I think not , many suffer because of him but he tried to make himself look like one .That pissed me right off.
I am still aghast at how he was treated . Not allowed to answer questions ; questions hurled at him 3 at a time without being given the chance to answer them ; all the panel quoting from the media ( a thing most of them usually complain of; the panel going uninterupted by Dimbleby even though they had gone way off topic;and most of all using his unpopularity for their own ends.They also planted him in the west end of London, that way , they ensured he did not gain any debate. It was all manipulated and that's what I hate.
The people of this country sometimes don't know when they are being duped.
Personally I am sickened by the "anti-facist" movement, to me it's the same as the bleeding heart liberals being up in arms about the Daily Mail article about Gately.
Yes you can have freedom of speech but only if we agree with it ??? WTF!!!!
Dubz
This post is only, just, almost, rescued from the clutches of complete insanity by the use of quotation marks round "anti-fascist". Personally, I would rank "anti-fascism" up there with the best of things. Probably alongside boobs and my childhood teddy bear 'Big Ted'. As movements go, being "anti-facist" is pretty cool. It certainly beats being "pro-facist" or even just a middle of the road abstaining neutral who lets fascists go about their business and generally finds them inoffensive.
Freedom of speech is great, its an excellent priveledge. Thats why it was great to have Nick Griffin on Question time, as it is in the best interest of a free, democratic society, who's media presents no bias. And if he choses to go on the show, and the audience chose to destroy him in a particularly undignified and perhaps un-debate-like way, then thats his freedom of choice. Doesn't stop me believing his views to be fundamentally a-moral and more than a little racist, homophobic and laughable.
And as for the Jan Moir article on Steven Gately, you're confusing 'freedom of speech' with 'saying whatever the fuck you want'. Her article contravened a number of rudamentary principles of written news, not to mention codes of practice. Simple things such as adhering to the facts.
I suppose I could have replied to this with a simple 'what. the. fuck' but I felt the need to elaborate.
Absolute bullshite !!!
being "Anti" anything means you are no longer open to discussion, debate, or arguement you have already made up your mind. I am not saying that being anti facist is right or wrong. I am merely stating that the minute you become fanatical about a belief you are no longer open to discussion. For example there are a bunch of athiests kicking around the states who are agressively pushing their belifs upon others which IMHO makes them just as bad as the the WASP right wingers. You can actually be pro "whatever" without being anti "whatever" contary to popular belief.
btw. freedom of speech IS saying whatever the fuck you want!!
So you're suggesting I should be open to the opinions of fascists, in case they have something valuable to tell me?! Who do you think I am? Neville Chamberlain? Has history taught you nothing?!
For those not in the know, the BNP is, as far as I can tell, a poliitical party built around a fundamentally racist ideology. Who are frighteningly growing in popularity.
I'm not surprised the BNP are growing in popularity. I live in an area which has a high Muslim population. I'm sick of the politicians trying to get people to 'integrate'. It'll never work out how they want it to, it's a pipe dream. I went to a school which was dominated 60/40 by Muslims and I had no problem 'intigrating', this was simply because I wanted to, I don't judge people by the colour of their skin or their religion. Sadly a lot of people did judge and always will do. If you try and throw people together and say 'you must get along' then people will rebel, it's only natural.
My best friend is Muslim, her family have been her for over 30 years yet her mother has not learnt English. We communicate in broken sentences and it really annoys me because she feels she doesn't need to learn the language - all the information she needs is provided in Urdu by the government and she relies heavily on her children. She has contributed nothing to this society and so yes, for reasons like these I do agree with the BNP on some things. I'm sure if I went to India or Pakistan I would be expected to learn the language and abide by the culture of the country. Why are we such pushovers here?
I felt sorry for Nick Griffin on QT - he was obviously nervous and knew what was going to happen with regards to being shouted down and booed, but he brought that on himself, he wanted the publicity.
