I'm a 'staunch' physicist, and because I'm a scientist, I cannot be at number 7 because I have no evidence that God does not exist. You can only really say something about the liklihood - its like if I tell you there is a talking cup of tea orbiting Alpha Centauri (the star), there is no evidence to say there is not, as there is none to say there is, so until it is proven, its likliehood remains incredibly small based on our current knowledge.
I'd have to ask for your scientific proof as a scientist that God doesn't exist if you are committing to 7, just as any scientific journal would ask of you. What you really have is a hypothesis.
I'm a 'staunch' physicist, and because I'm a scientist, I cannot be at number 7 because I have no evidence that God does not exist. You can only really say something about the liklihood - its like if I tell you there is a talking cup of tea orbiting Alpha Centauri (the star), there is no evidence to say there is not, as there is none to say there is, so until it is proven, its likliehood remains incredibly small based on our current knowledge.
I'd have to ask for your scientific proof as a scientist that God doesn't exist if you are committing to 7, just as any scientific journal would ask of you. What you really have is a hypothesis.
I could have made this a long and tiresome discussion, but I will keep my mouth shut. I never discuss religion. I have no need no prove to anyone why I don't believe in a god. In my universe there is no God, there never was a God and there will never be a God. You just asked what number we are on the faith scale, and I answered that I am a 7. What you are, I don't care, neither do I care why you are what you are. Discussing science and religion is like discussing two things that are not in the same context.
I could have made this a long and tiresome discussion, but I will keep my mouth shut. I never discuss religion. I have no need no prove to anyone why I don't believe in a god. In my universe there is no God, there never was a God and there will never be a God. You just asked what number we are on the faith scale, and I answered that I am a 7. What you are, I don't care, neither do I care why you are what you are. Discussing science and religion is like discussing two things that are not in the same context.
Its a poll, its showing in general what are the demographics - the poll didn't ask anything about science, I'm saying as an atheist scientist, who is probably number 6.5 ish, in a friendly manner, that as a scientist you shouldn't ever be dealing in absolutes. The piont of the post is that you comment if you want to share your beliefs and WHY you believe them. If you don't want to share, thats fine - but saying something doesn't exist doesn't make it true in a scientific context.
Its a poll, its showing in general what are the demographics - the poll didn't ask anything about science, I'm saying as an atheist scientist, who is probably number 6.5 ish, in a friendly manner, that as a scientist you shouldn't ever be dealing in absolutes. The piont of the post is that you comment if you want to share your beliefs and WHY you believe them. If you don't want to share, thats fine - but saying something doesn't exist doesn't make it true in a scientific context.
Thank you so much for letting me know that I should never deal with absolutes. I will remember that when I hand in my thesis in molecular biology this spring.
Its a poll, its showing in general what are the demographics - the poll didn't ask anything about science, I'm saying as an atheist scientist, who is probably number 6.5 ish, in a friendly manner, that as a scientist you shouldn't ever be dealing in absolutes. The piont of the post is that you comment if you want to share your beliefs and WHY you believe them. If you don't want to share, thats fine - but saying something doesn't exist doesn't make it true in a scientific context.
Thank you so much for letting me know that I should never deal with absolutes. I will remember that when I hand in my thesis in molecular biology this spring.
You're welcome. I'm always sure to keep in mind that nothing is provable to be fact at 100%, but to have a demonstrated liklihood of 100/100. I keep this in mind when I submit papers for the physics journals on sonoluminescence, quantum theory, nuclear medicine and sonoptic radiative bodies.
Is this a contest of who studies/ works with the most 'brainy' science? Coz you win Dave, you win! I hope you win a Nobel prize! KUDOS TO YOU!!! Woooooo! GO DAVE!
Thats an interesting one. It's difficult to be a 7 in scientific reality, because you are comitting to the absolute knowledge that there is not, and never has been any God of any type. And as a scientist myself, I couldn't commit to that because its not ethically or even mathematically sound given the knowledge (or lack of) that we have.
What are your views?
Obviously i cant proove there is no god. Its just what i believe!
Thats a good inbetween state!
But still on the theistic side.
What exactly do you mean by 'feeling'? What feeling is it you are experiencing, and what evidence do you have that persuades you that this feeling is the probability of a God's existence?
Hmm, it's difficult to explain a feeling. Maybe it's a consequence of going to church regularly, or singing in a gospel choir. It's this feeling of a higher power, something that makes me happy and gives me some sort of inner peace. I'm fairly certain to have read an article about this feeling; like everything else, it's the brain playing a trick on me.
Nevertheless, I feel like there's always someone there with me somehow. Some people call this paranoia :oP However, this is not a scary feeling.
Explaining my faith is difficult. Maybe that's why faith is usually defined as a belief in something you cannot prove.
Thats a good inbetween state!
But still on the theistic side.
What exactly do you mean by 'feeling'? What feeling is it you are experiencing, and what evidence do you have that persuades you that this feeling is the probability of a God's existence?
Hmm, it's difficult to explain a feeling. Maybe it's a consequence of going to church regularly, or singing in a gospel choir. It's this feeling of a higher power, something that makes me happy and gives me some sort of inner peace. I'm fairly certain to have read an article about this feeling; like everything else, it's the brain playing a trick on me.
Nevertheless, I feel like there's always someone there with me somehow. Some people call this paranoia :oP However, this is not a scary feeling.
Explaining my faith is difficult. Maybe that's why faith is usually defined as a belief in something you cannot prove.
You seem to be talking a lot of sense and thinking carefully about it all and looking at the various possibilties, but having said that you aren't following through. I would deffinately encourage you to constantly question your faith to instill and recognise these feelings on less biased bases. Don't just beleive in something because you have been told to, or because you feel you need to, think carefully about why you believe in something - what is your justification for your belief?
You're only really re-wording what a staunch theist would say, for example, I can say I 'feel' like there is a tlaking ucp of tea at the closest star, and I believe it because of past experience. It doesn't make a lot of sense realistically as to WHY I believe it.
Personal testemony cannot prove something, you need to think about what the empirical evidence is - you hit the nail on the head when you said the brain can play tricks, and thats true for everyone - its a lot easier to believe in something because many others do and have in history, which doens't make it true. Take for example that Gallileo was more or less the only person at his time who believed the earth orbited the sun, and the catholic church imprisoned him for this on the grounds of heresy (it went against the bible's teachings) - almost everyone else (due to religeon) believed the sun orbited the earth at the centre of the universe. See?
You seem to be talking a lot of sense and thinking carefully about it all and looking at the various possibilties, but having said that you aren't following through. I would deffinately encourage you to constantly question your faith to instill and recognise these feelings on less biased bases. Don't just beleive in something because you have been told to, or because you feel you need to, think carefully about why you believe in something - what is your justification for your belief?
You're only really re-wording what a staunch theist would say, for example, I can say I 'feel' like there is a tlaking ucp of tea at the closest star, and I believe it because of past experience. It doesn't make a lot of sense realistically as to WHY I believe it.
Personal testemony cannot prove something, you need to think about what the empirical evidence is - you hit the nail on the head when you said the brain can play tricks, and thats true for everyone - its a lot easier to believe in something because many others do and have in history, which doens't make it true. Take for example that Gallileo was more or less the only person at his time who believed the earth orbited the sun, and the catholic church imprisoned him for this on the grounds of heresy (it went against the bible's teachings) - almost everyone else (due to religeon) believed the sun orbited the earth at the centre of the universe. See?
Justification for my belief? Problem is, there is no such thing! I'm not an uneducated person. Having taken a master's degree, I've been trained to justify my opinions and question all I hear and read. My religion is the only thing I cannot possibly explain with reason.
Of course there is the empirical evidence, as you say. I could just be doing it because I grew up with it. The thing is, my parents and brother hardly ever go to church. The whole religion thing is something I got myself into. Who knows, if I'd grown up in a catholic country, I would probably be catholic and not a protestant. If I'd grown up in a muslim country, I'd probably be a muslim. But I don't know that since I grew up where I did.
My point is that no matter how much I have questioned all of this over the years, I still believe.
You seem to be talking a lot of sense and thinking carefully about it all and looking at the various possibilties, but having said that you aren't following through. I would deffinately encourage you to constantly question your faith to instill and recognise these feelings on less biased bases. Don't just beleive in something because you have been told to, or because you feel you need to, think carefully about why you believe in something - what is your justification for your belief?
You're only really re-wording what a staunch theist would say, for example, I can say I 'feel' like there is a tlaking ucp of tea at the closest star, and I believe it because of past experience. It doesn't make a lot of sense realistically as to WHY I believe it.
Personal testemony cannot prove something, you need to think about what the empirical evidence is - you hit the nail on the head when you said the brain can play tricks, and thats true for everyone - its a lot easier to believe in something because many others do and have in history, which doens't make it true. Take for example that Gallileo was more or less the only person at his time who believed the earth orbited the sun, and the catholic church imprisoned him for this on the grounds of heresy (it went against the bible's teachings) - almost everyone else (due to religeon) believed the sun orbited the earth at the centre of the universe. See?
Justification for my belief? Problem is, there is no such thing! I'm not an uneducated person. Having taken a master's degree, I've been trained to justify my opinions and question all I hear and read. My religion is the only thing I cannot possibly explain with reason.
Of course there is the empirical evidence, as you say. I could just be doing it because I grew up with it. The thing is, my parents and brother hardly ever go to church. The whole religion thing is something I got myself into. Who knows, if I'd grown up in a catholic country, I would probably be catholic and not a protestant. If I'd grown up in a muslim country, I'd probably be a muslim. But I don't know that since I grew up where I did.
My point is that no matter how much I have questioned all of this over the years, I still believe.
OK - not being cheeky here, but Ill try and examplify.
You're a therapist and someone tells you they think thay'll die if they don't switch the lights on and off 100 times before they leave a room. The know there is no real reason for this, they understand theres nothing about walking out of a room outwith normal chance would kill them, but they beleive it. You, as a therapist, would be questioning their sanity surely?
Take for example that Gallileo was more or less the only person at his time who believed the earth orbited the sun, and the catholic church imprisoned him for this on the grounds of heresy (it went against the bible's teachings) - almost everyone else (due to religeon) believed the sun orbited the earth at the centre of the universe. See?
Galileo published an argument in favor of the sun-centered solar system, but it was already a Copernican theory. Gotta stand up for my Polish peeps. Give 'em some credit! :P
OK - not being cheeky here, but Ill try and examplify.
You're a therapist and someone tells you they think thay'll die if they don't switch the lights on and off 100 times before they leave a room. The know there is no real reason for this, they understand theres nothing about walking out of a room outwith normal chance would kill them, but they beleive it. You, as a therapist, would be questioning their sanity surely?
I would think that they suffer from OCD.
Religion is probably some sort of mental illness. What do I know. Problem is, it's not recognised as a mental illness and therefore not treated.
Take for example that Gallileo was more or less the only person at his time who believed the earth orbited the sun, and the catholic church imprisoned him for this on the grounds of heresy (it went against the bible's teachings) - almost everyone else (due to religeon) believed the sun orbited the earth at the centre of the universe. See?
Galileo published an argument in favor of the sun-centered solar system, but it was already a Copernican theory. Gotta stand up for my Polish peeps. Give 'em some credit! :P
Lol thanks Nikki
I already new that becides I'm 1/4 polish - it was just easier to get my point across because of the victimisation of gallileo
OK - not being cheeky here, but Ill try and examplify.
You're a therapist and someone tells you they think thay'll die if they don't switch the lights on and off 100 times before they leave a room. The know there is no real reason for this, they understand theres nothing about walking out of a room outwith normal chance would kill them, but they beleive it. You, as a therapist, would be questioning their sanity surely?
True
I once heard that point for point a set of 20 therapists were given in a non-biased form the beliefs and faiths of a christian dressed up to be non-religeos (basically replacing the word god with another) and they were asked for a prognosis of the patient.
most of them said a combinaation of paranoia, delusion, schitzophrenia and denial.
I would think that they suffer from OCD.
Religion is probably some sort of mental illness. What do I know. Problem is, it's not recognised as a mental illness and therefore not treated.
